Norwich City 3 wins Norwich CEYMS 1 win 2 draws
Norwich City goals 14 Norwich CEYMS goals 10
Games at Norwich
Norwich City 1 win Norwich CEYMS 1 win 1 draw
Norwich City goals 7 Norwich CEYMS goals 6
Games at Norwich CEYMS
Norwich City 2 wins Norwich CEYMS 0 wins 1 draw
Norwich City goals 7 Norwich Ceyms goals 4
Many of the biggest and finest football clubs in England today can trace their roots back to churches or religious organisations, and the same can loosely be said of Norwich City. For the club we love today emerged as a result of a breakaway by men associated with Norwich Church of England Young Men's Society FC in 1902.
Norwich CEYMS FC, who were also known as 'Church' or 'Initials', was the football section of the organisation. The Society had been founded way back in 1847 as a means to provide young men with opportunities to uphold a religious way of life. Many sporting activities took place, and football was added in 1888. It did not take Church long to establish themselves as the leading team in the area. In 1892 they lifted the Norfolk Senior Cup, the first of five such triumphs between then and 1904. They joined a new competition in 1897 called the Norfolk & Suffolk League and won it. Interestingly, Ipswich Town joined that league in 1899-00, so CEYMS can claim to have taken part in an East Anglian Derby before Norwich City.
What they did not foresee however was the inclination of some of their members to form a new club in the city. It is often said that this was done because a lack of ambition prevailed within the CEYMS set up. However, it should be remembered that their ethos was very much amateur - they played hard and keenly but always in the spirit of fairness and sportsmanship. The breakaway was more likely driven by the personal challenge that individuals found in the idea of the creation of a rival club - two Norwich teams battling for supremacy, and the interest that would follow. In other parts of the country, and especially in the north, football was already a professional sport. This too would have been uppermost in the minds of those behind the initiative.
Robert Webster and Joseph Cowper Nutchey were captain and vice captain of CEYMS, and became the forefathers of Norwich City FC in June 1902. Great efforts were made to suggest that relationships between the old and new organisations were amicable. But below the surface, the usual jealousies and frictions simmered away. Things were not helped by the inevitable migration of key players to the City club from CEYMS, notably Robert Whiteley Collinson, a fine sportsman who would go on to be a prominent Citizen and later Canary official.
Norwich City immediately joined the Norfolk & Suffolk League, so in no time at all, any anger could be taken out on the field of play. The first competitive Norwich Derby took place on the 26th of December 1902 and it would turn out to be the most exciting match in the six game series. City won 4-2 with Bertie Playford scoring twice in the first half, and then Collinson converting two second half penalties - an indication no doubt as to the needle that almost certainly prevailed. Much to their credit however, CEYMS turned the tables at Newmarket Road when the teams met a month later, recording a fine 2-1 victory.
1903-04 season saw both matches tied. A thrilling 3-3 draw in January 1904 included goals for City by Tommy Newell and Reginald Desborough - both CEYMS old boys.
But by 1904-05, it was clear that Norwich City had progressed both on and off the field. A league double was secured and the Citizens had started to throw their net far wider when recruiting new players. They finished as champions of the Norfolk & Suffolk League, meaning they had finished above CEYMS in all three campaigns. But the principles of each club had also polarised. Whilst Church continued their amateur ways, viewing football as healthy recreation above anything else, Norwich City became embroiled in accusations of being professional. They were of course found guilty, and this led to Webster and Nutchey pursuing membership of the Southern League for 1905-06.
The path taken by both clubs were wide apart from this time onwards. Happily though, CEYMS were themselves champions of the Norfolk & Suffolk League in 1906-07 and again in 1910-11.
It should be added that quite a few non competitive friendly and charity matches took place between the clubs, though there is no telling exactly how friendly, or indeed charitable, they were ! One such fixture, on the 18th of October 1902 and a 2-1 win to City, slightly precedes that initial Norfolk & Suffolk League contest. Also, in the first three seasons in which the Norfolk & Norwich Hospital Cup was played for (between 1904 and 1906) Norwich CEYMS were the club invited to compete. City won all three, though two needed a replay.
Fantastically, Church still exist today, playing in the Anglian Combination.
. For a list of players associated with both clubs, click here
http://canaryseventyninety.blogspot.co.uk/2012/07/norwich-city-norwich-ceyms-players.html
. For a list of Norwich City players who made their debut against Norwich CEYMS, click here http://canaryseventyninety.blogspot.co.uk/2012/07/norwich-city-debuts-versus-norwich-ceyms.html
. For more on the period surrounding the formation of NCFC, click here
http://canaryseventyninety.blogspot.co.uk/2010/07/and-this-is-where-it-all-started.html
. For more on the life of Robert 'Bob' Collinson, click here
http://canaryseventyninety.blogspot.co.uk/2010/09/stars-of-past-bob-collinson.html
Many of the biggest and finest football clubs in England today can trace their roots back to churches or religious organisations, and the same can loosely be said of Norwich City. For the club we love today emerged as a result of a breakaway by men associated with Norwich Church of England Young Men's Society FC in 1902.
Norwich CEYMS FC, who were also known as 'Church' or 'Initials', was the football section of the organisation. The Society had been founded way back in 1847 as a means to provide young men with opportunities to uphold a religious way of life. Many sporting activities took place, and football was added in 1888. It did not take Church long to establish themselves as the leading team in the area. In 1892 they lifted the Norfolk Senior Cup, the first of five such triumphs between then and 1904. They joined a new competition in 1897 called the Norfolk & Suffolk League and won it. Interestingly, Ipswich Town joined that league in 1899-00, so CEYMS can claim to have taken part in an East Anglian Derby before Norwich City.
What they did not foresee however was the inclination of some of their members to form a new club in the city. It is often said that this was done because a lack of ambition prevailed within the CEYMS set up. However, it should be remembered that their ethos was very much amateur - they played hard and keenly but always in the spirit of fairness and sportsmanship. The breakaway was more likely driven by the personal challenge that individuals found in the idea of the creation of a rival club - two Norwich teams battling for supremacy, and the interest that would follow. In other parts of the country, and especially in the north, football was already a professional sport. This too would have been uppermost in the minds of those behind the initiative.
Robert Webster and Joseph Cowper Nutchey were captain and vice captain of CEYMS, and became the forefathers of Norwich City FC in June 1902. Great efforts were made to suggest that relationships between the old and new organisations were amicable. But below the surface, the usual jealousies and frictions simmered away. Things were not helped by the inevitable migration of key players to the City club from CEYMS, notably Robert Whiteley Collinson, a fine sportsman who would go on to be a prominent Citizen and later Canary official.
Norwich City immediately joined the Norfolk & Suffolk League, so in no time at all, any anger could be taken out on the field of play. The first competitive Norwich Derby took place on the 26th of December 1902 and it would turn out to be the most exciting match in the six game series. City won 4-2 with Bertie Playford scoring twice in the first half, and then Collinson converting two second half penalties - an indication no doubt as to the needle that almost certainly prevailed. Much to their credit however, CEYMS turned the tables at Newmarket Road when the teams met a month later, recording a fine 2-1 victory.
1903-04 season saw both matches tied. A thrilling 3-3 draw in January 1904 included goals for City by Tommy Newell and Reginald Desborough - both CEYMS old boys.
But by 1904-05, it was clear that Norwich City had progressed both on and off the field. A league double was secured and the Citizens had started to throw their net far wider when recruiting new players. They finished as champions of the Norfolk & Suffolk League, meaning they had finished above CEYMS in all three campaigns. But the principles of each club had also polarised. Whilst Church continued their amateur ways, viewing football as healthy recreation above anything else, Norwich City became embroiled in accusations of being professional. They were of course found guilty, and this led to Webster and Nutchey pursuing membership of the Southern League for 1905-06.
The path taken by both clubs were wide apart from this time onwards. Happily though, CEYMS were themselves champions of the Norfolk & Suffolk League in 1906-07 and again in 1910-11.
It should be added that quite a few non competitive friendly and charity matches took place between the clubs, though there is no telling exactly how friendly, or indeed charitable, they were ! One such fixture, on the 18th of October 1902 and a 2-1 win to City, slightly precedes that initial Norfolk & Suffolk League contest. Also, in the first three seasons in which the Norfolk & Norwich Hospital Cup was played for (between 1904 and 1906) Norwich CEYMS were the club invited to compete. City won all three, though two needed a replay.
Fantastically, Church still exist today, playing in the Anglian Combination.
. For a list of players associated with both clubs, click here
http://canaryseventyninety.blogspot.co.uk/2012/07/norwich-city-norwich-ceyms-players.html
. For a list of Norwich City players who made their debut against Norwich CEYMS, click here http://canaryseventyninety.blogspot.co.uk/2012/07/norwich-city-debuts-versus-norwich-ceyms.html
. For more on the period surrounding the formation of NCFC, click here
http://canaryseventyninety.blogspot.co.uk/2010/07/and-this-is-where-it-all-started.html
. For more on the life of Robert 'Bob' Collinson, click here
http://canaryseventyninety.blogspot.co.uk/2010/09/stars-of-past-bob-collinson.html
Did You Know ?
Norwich CEYMS initially played on Earlham Rec, and after World War Two moved into Norwich City's first ground at Newmarket Road. Later they moved slightly south down the road to the site used by the Civil Service, and in 1988 to Swardeston.
To see what part Norwich CEYMS have played in the history of Norwich City Football Club, just pop their name into the search facility in the sidebar.
Most recent games
8 Apr 1905 (Norfolk & Suffolk League) Norwich City 3 Norwich CEYMS 1
18 Mar 1905 (Norfolk & Suffolk League) Norwich CEYMS 1 Norwich City 2
23 Apr 1904 (Norfolk & Suffolk League) Norwich CEYMS 1 Norwich City 1
30 Jan 1904 (Norfolk & Suffolk League) Norwich City 3 Norwich CEYMS 3
31 Jan 1903 (Norfolk & Suffolk League) Norwich City 1 Norwich CEYMS 2
26 Dec 1902 (Norfolk & Suffolk League) Norwich CEYMS 2 Norwich City 4
Bob Collinson - former Norwich CEYMS player who went on to be a pioneer of the Norwich City club
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